Legislature(2013 - 2014)BUTROVICH 205
01/30/2013 03:30 PM Senate RESOURCES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| Presentation: Alaska Department of Fish and Game (adf&g) Overview | |
| Presentation: Department of Environmental Conservation (dec) Overview | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
SENATE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE
January 30, 2013
3:30 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Senator Cathy Giessel, Chair
Senator Fred Dyson, Vice Chair
Senator Peter Micciche
Senator Click Bishop
Senator Anna Fairclough
Senator Hollis French
MEMBERS ABSENT
Senator Lesil McGuire
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
PRESENTATION: ALASKA DEPARTMENT OF FISH AND GAME (ADF&G)
OVERVIEW
- HEARD
PRESENTATION: DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL CONSERVATION (DEC)
OVERVIEW
- HEARD
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
No previous action to record
WITNESS REGISTER
CORA CAMPBELL, Commissioner
Alaska Department of Fish and Game (ADF&G)
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented overview of the Department of Fish
and Game.
LARRY HARTIG, Commissioner
Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC)
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented overview of the Department of
Environmental Conservation.
ACTION NARRATIVE
3:30:00 PM
CHAIR CATHY GIESSEL called the Senate Resources Standing
Committee meeting to order at 3:30 p.m. Present at the call to
order were Senators Dyson, Fairclough, Micciche, Bishop, French
and Chair Giessel.
^Presentation: Alaska Department of Fish and Game (ADF&G)
Overview
Presentation: Alaska Department of Fish and Game (ADF&G)
Overview
3:30:35 PM
CHAIR GIESSEL said they would start today with of the Alaska
Department of Fish and Game (ADF&G) and invited Commissioner
Cora Campbell forward.
3:31:08 PM
CORA CAMPBELL, Commissioner, Alaska Department of Fish and Game
(ADF&G), Juneau, Alaska, said her presentation would provide a
high level overview of the department and presented slides of
the departments mission statement and the statutes they were
derived from.
She said the department has six core services:
-harvest management: look at the commercial harvest, the
purchases of hunting and fishing licenses, number of angler days
on the water and the success the users have
-stock assessment: look at how frequently escapement goals are
met for salmon; how often wildlife surveys are conducted
-customer service: enacted to have angling skills programs,
hunter, heritage and educational programs; informing people
about wildlife and wildlife management and generally providing
information to their constituents
-public involvement: ensuring public has the information and the
ability to participate in the regulatory processes through the
Boards of Fisheries and Game; conducting a lot of outreach
making sure the public has the ability to weigh in on its
decisions
-state sovereignty: protect the state's sovereignty in federal
land management planning and Endangered Species Act work;
support the Department of Law (DOL) when it has a challenge in
one of those areas; spend time in the federal subsistence board
process and just spend energy on attempting to protect the
state's authority to manage fish and wildlife
-habitat protection: protect important fish and wildlife habitat
during permit and project review; ensuring compliance with
permits and making sure permitting is happening in a consistent
and timely manner
3:33:55 PM
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL included an overview of the department's
locations throughout the state indicated regional and area
offices in many communities. She said the department is designed
to be fairly broadly distributed and to have biologists on the
ground in the field near the resources and the users. The
overview didn't include the many places where the department has
a seasonal camp or is running a weir or sonar.
3:34:29 PM
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL next ran through the three large
management divisions: Commercial sport Fisheries, Sport
Fisheries and Wildlife Conservation and several smaller
divisions.
3:34:59 PM
Starting with the largest she said, the Division of Commercial
Fisheries is responsible for managing commercial fisheries and
research related to those resources, but they are also
responsible for management of many personal use and subsistence
fisheries in state waters. It manages some species and resources
from 3 to 200 miles under agreements with the federal
government. This division is also responsible for permitting any
aquaculture or mariculture operations in the state.
3:35:29 PM
The Division of Sport Fish is responsible for management of
sport fisheries and research related to those resources. They
also have responsibilities for promoting boater access, angler
access and programs designed to preserve access opportunities
for anglers.
The Division of Wildlife Conservation is responsible for
management of wildlife, hunting and scientific surveys of
wildlife; it also operates three shooting ranges throughout the
state and has a number of hunter education programs and
partnerships that are aimed at getting to learn about the
outdoors and gun safety.
3:36:20 PM
The Division of Subsistence is smaller and its primary function
is research and gathering information on customary and
traditional use of Alaska's fish and wildlife. It is not a
management division.
3:37:06 PM
The Division of Habitat is another small division; its
responsibilities include permitting activities that take place
on anadromus water bodies or in fish bearing waters and also
permitting anything that could have an impact on fish and
wildlife that takes place in any of the state's 32 special areas
(critical habitat areas and wildlife refuges). They also monitor
in-the-field compliance with the permits they issue.
3:37:30 PM
The Division of Administrative Services does budget and HR
activities.
3:37:48 PM
The Board Support Section is a very small part of the department
but performs an important function providing all the logistical
support for the state's fish and wildlife regulatory meetings
including 80 advisory committee meetings and assists the public
in understanding what is happening in those forums.
3:38:13 PM
They also have two independent agencies that are attached to
ADF&G for administrative purposes: the Commercial Fisheries
Entry Commission (CFEC) and the Exxon Valdez Oil Spill Trustee
Council (made up of three state and three federal trustees) who
administer some of the research and restoration funding that
came about as a result of the oil spill (the ADF&G Commissioner
is one of the trustees).
3:38:53 PM
SENATOR DYSON commented that he was in Gulf shortly after the
platform blowout along with quite a few scientists, but sadly
the word was that the same mistakes on containment and
reclamation were being made; so not much was learned from the
Exxon Valdez. However, that was just his preamble for saying
that establishing the Exxon Valdez Oil Spill Counsel was one of
the wisest things that has been done with oil spills. Among the
worthwhile things it has done is establish a pre-accident base
line so a damage assessment could be made.
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL thanked him for those comments.
3:40:12 PM
She said the department has about 933 full-time staff positions,
but more than 1700 total positions. This reflects the seasonal
nature of their work and the fact that three of the divisions
are very large and make up the bulk of the staffing.
3:41:19 PM
She had a chart of their overall budget both by division and
funding source. The three management divisions account for a
large portion of the budget and their three largest funding
sources are general fund, federal funds and the Fish and Game
Fund.
SENATOR MICCICHE asked how many test fisheries exist in the
state that bring $19 million in revenue to the state.
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL said she didn't have the exact number, but
there are a number of test fisheries throughout the state. Their
focus is on test fisheries that serve a scientific purpose that
is relevant to the management of the fishery as opposed to
revenue fishing when the department harvests fish to support
management activities and the fish don't provide direct
scientific information for management. She offered to get him
that information.
3:42:51 PM
She outlined the major department accomplishments in 2012:
-salmon research programs: the completion of the Western Alaska
salmon stock I.D. program that was the largest of its kind to
date, a multi-year effort to better understand the genetic
makeup of salmon that were harvested in Western Alaska
fisheries. It involved a lot of consultation with stakeholders
and a lot of work by the genetics lab that has produced nine
reports that are now being used in the current Board of
Fisheries cycle to help inform the management decisions the
board is making about those fisheries.
3:43:56 PM
SENATOR BISHOP asked if the I.D. program is working as
advertised and if she had enough staff and resources to bring
information forward in a timely manner.
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL replied that the Western Alaska Salmon
Stock I.D. program specifically had a number of goals, many of
which were met upon completion of the program. The one that was
not met is that users were hoping for better differentiation of
returning chum salmon up and down the Western Alaska coast. They
want to specify when a chum is harvested where it was headed.
That level of detail isn't currently possible as a result of
this project, but it is something they will continue to work
towards in the future.
3:45:01 PM
She noted that the department is requesting some funding as part
of the Chinook salmon research initiative that is specifically
for genetics work. Base line information for King salmon needs
to be improved in terms of their understanding of genetic
differences between different river systems, so that when they
analyze a fish it can be attributed to its river of origin. But
in general, the genetics lab is doing a good job of analyzing
the samples that they have and getting the information out to
inform decision makers.
Some of their intensive management programs have increased
wildlife populations and increased harvest opportunities in
certain areas the commissioner reported. The South Alaska
Peninsula herd had increased its moose population as well as in
Game Management Unit 20. Other programs were being modified as
the impacts of various predators were being learned.
3:47:08 PM
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL said a couple of years ago the Subsistence
Division was identified as a real challenge. In many cases it
was dealing with data for communities that was decades old (in
many cases more than 25 years). So, that division was
coordinating with DNR and DOTPF so as development projects are
proposed one of the things that is required in the permitting
process is up-to-date subsistence information, so the impacts on
subsistence harvesters can be understood. This work has the dual
benefit of enabling the decision making process for whatever
permits may be required on those projects to go faster by having
the information that is needed at hand, but also for them to
update their own data bases for use by the Boards of Fisheries
and Game when they are making determinations about the amount
necessary for subsistence or those types of things.
She said the department requested some funding last year for the
Habitat Division to be more involved early on in the pre-
permitting project design phase for some of the larger projects
just to be able to keep up with the demand in that division for
timely permitting, and they have been able to keep their
permitting turn-around days within the targets they had set for
them.
The Commissioner said their two sport fish hatcheries in
Anchorage and Fairbanks are up and running, producing fish that
are being used to stock lakes and rivers and providing fishing
opportunities. Stock levels are back to the level they were
before they lost the ability to use the waste heat from the
Elmendorf Air Force Base. The quality of the smolts is very
good; they're growing fast and are healthy when released.
3:49:53 PM
Issues and Challenges:
-Chinook salmon abundance and productivity is in a period of
decline throughout the state, more severe in some regions than
others. The need to ensure their escapement this summer led to a
number of restrictions on fisheries that had tremendous impacts
on Alaskans. It really illustrated quite clearly this summer the
extent to which Alaskans rely on healthy Chinook salmon whether
it's for subsistence, commercial or sport fishing, or personal
use.
In response to that the department, developed the Comprehensive
Chinook Salmon Research Plan in order to shore up their
understanding of the causes for this period of low abundance.
That plan has identified 12 stocks throughout the state they
consider to be good fits for indicator stocks to give them an
indication of what is happening in that region. Then it is
proposing projects to increase their understanding of the trends
in adult harvest, escapement, and smolt out-migration, and some
additional coded wire tagging to better understand where the
fish go and are harvested in the marine environment, some
genetics work and some increased biometrics. Overall, the goal
of the plan is to be able to understand the driving factors
behind the decrease in Chinook Salmon productivity to be able to
better forecast the length of time of low abundance or what
returns can be expected on an annual basis so that the
department can better target providing fishing opportunities
where it is available, where they can better plan for the need
to provide opportunity on other species while protecting Chinook
Salmon and make modifications in order to do that and to help
users who rely on Chinook Salmon to be able to plan accordingly.
3:52:21 PM
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL said a couple of initiatives last year
that were targeted in places where a better understanding of
what was happening with the stock would allow them to provide
increased fishing opportunity on that stock. A species of rock
fish is being studied, for example; they are long lived and are
not fast reproducers and so they want to be sure that they are
understood before doing anything. A small investment by the
state and an increased level of understanding about a stock
could really lead to a big payoff for Alaskans in terms of
either sport fishing opportunity or commercial fishing
opportunity, an economic benefit in either case.
The commissioner said this was related to another challenge:
reductions in their salmon management tools. The department has
absorbed a number of cost increases related to inflationary
pressures and negotiated salary increases, but the result of
that is that fewer funds are available for projects in the
water. So a weir that ran for two months might now run for six
weeks and not provide as good a sense of what's happening on the
shoulders of the season. So when putting together their budget
request for FY14 together they put requests to bring those
salmon management tools back up to past levels. It would
increase their understanding in a way that would allow them to
provide additional opportunity and additional benefit.
3:54:48 PM
CHAIR GIESSEL said she has the Kenai River in her district, a
hot spot this summer for a controversy surrounding a new
counting device; there was a question about whether it was
providing the same data as the old one. She asked how she was
managing the counting.
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL responded that counting the escapement on
the Kenai has been a challenge. The department found that the
old sonar wasn't providing an accurate picture of King Salmon
escapement primarily because Kings at times can be overwhelmed
by the number of sockeyes that are entering the river. The old
sonar misidentified sockeyes as King salmon inflating the number
for their escapement and that pattern got more severe in recent
years. In response to that, they deployed a Didson sonar, a
different type of sonar technology that allows different species
to be differentiated. A Didson doesn't just count blips like the
old sonar; it's almost video quality. You can see the fish
moving as it swims up the river.
She explained that the escapement goal was indexed to the old
system and having an escapement goal that was in a unit of
measure they were no longer able to count in really caused a
controversy this year. In response, the department developed a
new escapement goal that is based on and measured by the Didson
sonar. She remarked that it sounds like a simple thing to have
your escapement target and your measuring tool in the same unit
of measure, but that had not happened on the Kenai for several
years. When there is as much at stake as there is in those Cook
Inlet fisheries it is very difficult for users when you cannot
clearly point them to a single number and relate that to your
management target and the department thinks the 2013 season is
going to be a big improvement.
3:57:44 PM
SENATOR BISHOP asked if she were king for a day and could buy
any sonar on the planet what she would buy.
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL answered at this point the Didson sonar is
the best technology they are aware of for doing these kinds of
counting projects. It varies depending on the river you are
talking about - the width of the river and whether it has a lot
of debris - the challenges vary. They have a good level of
confidence in the Didson for this particular application and
have run an independent mark recapture program to verify King
salmon abundance that is completely separate from the sonar.
SENATOR FAIRCLOUGH asked the notification process for people
affected by closures when they are coming up quickly. One of her
constituents spent tens of thousands of dollars to outfit a boat
and then found out within a 24/48 hour period that the fishery
was closed and they couldn't return the products they had
purchased.
3:59:59 PM
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL answered they forecast pre-season in late
winter early spring what they expect to see coming back to these
rivers. Then they have a series of pre-season meetings with
users to try as best they can to get the word out if they expect
to see low abundance and restrictions. They are working on
better communication pre-season, but they don't always know pre-
season what they will see in-season and sometimes they have to
react quickly. When they make an announcement for a restriction
they always try to include the abundance information that led to
that restriction and whether they believe that further
restrictions or even a closure is possible in the future if that
trend continues. A wide range of media outlets are on their
press release list, they use radio and have recorded
announcements so people can call the office and get the latest
information, and they update the web page quite regularly.
4:02:42 PM
SENATOR DYSON said Bristol Bay is a very dynamic situation where
until the fish show up you don't know what's coming back. He
explained that millions of fish can go up three rivers in three
tides and that over-escapement can be an issue as well.
4:05:18 PM
SENATOR MICCICHE said he is a commercial fisherman in Cook Inlet
and the department does an excellent job of notification. The
problem in several of the last 10 years (and last year) is that
the upper end of the escapement goal for Chinook was learned too
late for hundreds of families in his district (and the northern
district as well) to salvage a living. He asked if the
department was working on a plan for a reaction time that does a
better job of understanding what the later fish will be in order
to maximize potential in harvesting other species.
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL agreed that the King salmon run was
unusually late this year to the extent that their prediction
around the middle of July was considerably lower than the final
number ended up being. But the question a manager always asks
himself when there is a low number - when maybe only half the
run is in is, "Is it weak or is it late or is it both?" That
resulted in this year's situation. So they are having a number
of discussions with users through the Board of Fisheries process
about the ability to have more of a step-down situation when
they see that. The management plan now is such a blunt tool;
it's essentially either on or off. And if you're predicting to
miss the lower end of that escapement goal, it is off according
to the management plan; the in-river fishery closes, the east
side set net fishery closes, and the marine water sport fishery
closes. So they would like to have more flexibility early in the
season to be able to step people down and provide some
opportunity while conserving Chinook until they get a better
sense of what the run timing is. This is what they hope to
achieve through that task force process.
4:08:25 PM
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL said they had increased their efforts in
the past year or so to get more involved in research on species
where they see a listing decision being made by a federal agency
in the future in terms of state sovereignty and endangered
species issues. They want to get into that process with state
science that is specifically targeted at the questions those
federal agencies will be asking about the status of the stock.
They had received additional funding and have targeted it at
that type of research to help prevent additional listings.
4:09:39 PM
The reason she lists it as a challenge is despite the fact that
the Department of Law has had a couple of important victories
lately - the Polar Bear Critical Habitat and the partial victory
on the Stellar Sea lion lawsuit related to the NEPA process -
they are seeing a trend by the federal government that they
hadn't seen in the past to list healthy species that are stable
and have good numbers as endangered based solely on speculation
about future climate change that is often based on computer
models. The most recent decision by the National Marine
Fisheries Service (NMFS) to list a species of Ice Seal with a
population of about 7 million really illustrates the fact that
if that is your logic, any species could be listed. Listing a
stable population that numbers in the millions where the agency
itself admits there is no immediate threat to the species in the
next several decades really skews the original purpose of the
Endangered Species Act.
SENATOR FAIRCLOUGH asked if Alaska is joining with other coastal
states that may be experiencing the same issues.
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL answered yes; Alaska has a strong alliance
through the Western Association of Fish and Wildlife Agencies
(our contemporaries in the western states) and the National
Association of Fish and Wildlife agencies. The State Attorney
General has been quite active in getting the National Attorney
General's group to take an interest in Endangered Species Act
issues. As these climate listings proliferate, they see that
Alaska is gaining more allies among states that are similarly
affected.
SENATOR MICCICHE said a third impact has been the dip net
fishery at the mouths of the Kenai and the Kasilof Rivers and
asked if she thinks she had adequate staff to enforce and manage
those two fisheries to her satisfaction.
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL answered that department area staff is
down there at times monitoring what is happening in that
fishery. The Alaska Wildlife Troopers are primarily responsible
for enforcement of the regulations in that fishery and they have
to prioritize their resources based on everything that is going
on, but from her point of view, there would be a benefit to an
additional presence when that fishery is going on. It has grown
dramatically.
4:13:20 PM
SENATOR FRENCH said as a participant in that fishery, he found
both the Wildlife Trooper and the City Police presence to be
fairly strong. A lot of people were enjoying the fishery, but
enforcement people were checking tickets, counting fish and
making sure the rules weren't being broken - at least when he
was there.
4:13:50 PM
COMMISSIONER CAMPBELL said she noted invasive species, whether
it's the invasive tunicate in Whiting Harbor or the invasive
pike in Southcentral lakes and rivers, they are trying to
eradicate, and that the department is putting efforts towards
eradicating invasive species when they are found but also
focusing on the prevention and educational aspects of this
program (that is housed within the Division of Sport Fish).
4:14:16 PM
She also noted the need to modernize the licensing system,
because they sell about 700,000 licenses a year and it's
primarily a paper system both at the consumer end and the vendor
reporting end. Using paper is labor intensive and not providing
the level of service that many customers want. People want to be
able to do online reporting for their personal use harvest
instead of mailing in a post card and many sport fish guides
would like electronic log books. An item in the capital budget
would allow them to bring that program into modern times.
CHAIR GIESSEL thanked her for providing them with such a good
overview.
^Presentation: Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC)
Overview
Presentation: Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC)
Overview
4:15:38 PM
SENATOR GIESSEL announced that the next presentation would come
from the Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC)
Commissioner Hartig.
4:16:09 PM
LARRY HARTIG, Commissioner, Department of Environmental
Conservation (DEC), Anchorage, Alaska, introduced his entire
department. He said their mission is to protect human health and
the environment saying that there is a direct linkage between
the two and that is how they measure their success as a
department.
He said the department has five divisions:
-Administration
-Environmental Health
-Air Quality
-Spill Prevention and Response
-Water
4:18:33 PM
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said the Division of Air Quality is the
smallest division. To maintain healthy air, they set standards
and incorporate them into permits and authorizations. Then they
monitor for compliance and effectiveness to make sure it's
working. They help people come into compliance if needed.
The department has an air permits program that issues three
types of permits; two are under delegation from the federal
Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) under the Clean Air Act.
Those are: pre-construction (for large facilities) and operating
permits (pulls all the conditions on air quality once the
facility is built into one permit) that are renewed every five
years; the third kind are minor permits that are issued for
smaller facilities. He said the monitor for compliance with
those.
Two other programs are a non-point source program for things
that don't come out of stacks such as road dust and monitoring
conditions in various communities and reporting to them on that.
4:20:39 PM
Challenges: Fairbanks has exceeded the human health level
national standards for fine particulate matter from combustion
of hydro carbons wood, coal or fuel oil that can cause adverse
health effects. They are required under federal law to work with
them in putting a plan together to attain those health-based
standards. It's challenging now because people are switching to
using cheaper fuels for heating like wood and coal, but they are
also high in particulate matter. He said the ultimate solution
may be gas.
4:22:01 PM
SENATOR BISHOP asked the consequences of failing to implement a
plan relative to the Clean Air Act.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG replied that the EPA could withhold about
$11 million in federal highway funding and put restrictions on
new federally permitted projects - for instance if a project has
X amount of (particulate matter) PMemissions, you would have
2.5
to have 2X reduction before you could put it in. That could
impact future development like a gas line project in Fairbanks.
SENATOR BISHOP asked if using gas would help lessen the PM
2.5
problem.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said yes, but even if you get gas in there
with state subsidies, people would have to switch, which would
mean that gas would have to be relatively affordable compared to
wood and coal.
SENATOR BISHOP said that was everyone's goal.
CHAIR GIESSEL asked if wood pellets produce less particulates
than regular wood.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG replied generally yes, although you can have
very clean burning wood and coal stoves, too.
SENATOR DYSON said he and Senator Fairclough represent an area
that has sometimes exceeded federal standards just because of
glacial dust and asked him to comment on that.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG answered that glacier dust is not quite as
fine a material as PM, the difference being .10 microns, but
2.10
it still has health impacts. He said that the EPA excludes
natural events in evaluating an area; for instance forest fires
generate a lot of PM emissions and those are excluded.
2.5
4:25:10 PM
SENATOR FAIRCLOUGH said she experienced minus-40 in Fairbanks
recently and asked how the feds view the inversion weather
system that could be holding in the emissions.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG replied that Fairbanks is a special
situation and the EPA is very understanding and trying to
provide as much flexibility as they can. But their driving goal
is to protect human health.
SENATOR FAIRCLOUGH said the issue for Fairbanks is that the
stick may be coming at them and they don't have a lot of choice,
because some families have built their lives there and have
invested hundreds of thousands if not millions of dollars.
4:27:14 PM
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said he sees two issues with Fairbanks:
overall coming into compliance with the PMhuman health-based
2.5
standards so the community has healthy air and on that there are
certain tools they can use to incentivize things like burning
dry wood versus wet wood and getting better burning devices
before getting natural gas. The other thing they are dealing
with is at the neighborhood level where there may be a
particular problem like a bad boiler.
SENATOR FAIRCLOUGH asked if the federal government has
appropriately placed the PM testing stations in Fairbanks to
capture the human health data. And secondly, she said the
legislature is promoting two engineering buildings in the
Fairbanks area and the campus uses a coal-gen operation for heat
and electricity. She wanted to know the likelihood of a coal
generation plant license being issued if Fairbanks has an
unresolved PMviolation. She said she could talk to him later
2.5
about it.
SENATOR BISHOP said maybe they need to get the commissioner to
Fairbanks when the session is over and have a good thorough
vetting of this issue. He was concerned about spring forest
fires that could "bust air quality for a day" and the feds need
to take that into consideration.
SENATOR MICCICHE said it's fascinating and counterproductive
that the EPA would restrict federal highway funds from a
community that is struggling to heat their homes and develop an
economy and asked if the EPA has a program for reducing PM
emissions that could help a community that has limited choices
for fuel sources.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said he believed that EPA is trying to work
with the state and Fairbanks and recognizes their unique
situation and wouldn't use the hammer liberally or quickly. The
EPA has "making reasonable progress" as a policy.
CHAIR GIESSEL remarked and yet the air quality in Fairbanks was
cited as justification for the emission control area that is
being instituted for ships 200 miles along the coast of North
America.
4:33:54 PM
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said the department is doing permit reform
by looking for efficiencies (for the department and the public)
and getting priorities right.
Going back to air quality issues, he said dust is an issue in
rural communities and they are working collaboratively with a
number of communities and DOTPF on keeping dust down.
He said the federal government is aggressively adopting new
standards that work for most of the country but not in Alaska.
4:36:02 PM
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said the Division of Environmental Health is
food safety, sanitation, public water systems (for 15 people or
more) and solid waste management (landfills primarily).
He said that basically the EPA adopts national rules that apply
to all public drinking water systems in the country and then the
states are required to implement those. Alaska gets about $11
million per year in grant funds from them for this program, but
it isn't directly related to new rules. So they are always
struggling to keep up with the new rules. It's a real struggle
for rural communities because sometimes the rules are complex
and difficult to implement. So, a big piece of what they do is
work with the rural communities to upgrade or adapt to new
rules.
4:37:26 PM
CHAIR GIESSEL asked if he manages the Village Safe Water
Program.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG answered that the Water Division does that.
They also manage the pesticide program, restricting their
application to certain lands and water and aerial applications.
He thought there would be more pressure to use pesticides for
invasive species and Alaska has been very hesitant to use it
that often.
Going back to permit reform, he explained that pesticides have
to be approved by the EPA, which is where the science happens;
its use and sales must be registered with the DEC in the state.
Once they are registered the science should be done, and as long
as they are being applied in compliance with all the federal
requirements, which the state adopts, he thought the department
shouldn't have to issue the same permit each time and go through
the same debate each time and that he would rather put his money
towards actually being in the field making sure they do what
they are supposed to do. So, he had been changing regulations to
move his agencies away from issuing a lot of permits to going
towards requiring an integrated pest management plan that looks
at alternatives to using pesticides, and if they use them how
they are going to train and oversee their people and apply it
safely. The money saved from not issuing permits will be spent
on more inspections. That will come into effect this summer.
CHAIR GIESSEL asked if he was also talking about herbicides.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG explained that pesticides is a broader
category that includes herbicides.
He said the solid waste refers to landfills; the big ones being
5 tons or more a day, like Anchorage; they are all permitted and
regulated. It's a little more challenging in the rural areas
where he was trying to move towards more of a best management
practices to lessen the impacts of their landfills rather than
spending a lot of time trying to get communities to comply with
permits. This would also lessen the permitting work for the
department.
4:40:50 PM
Under Food Safety and Sanitation, Commissioner Hartig said they
oversee food produced and consumed in the state. If it's shipped
outside the state the federal government oversees that, but they
contract with DEC to do their inspections, and the DEC works off
of that for state inspections in some of the rural communities.
SENATOR BISHOP said he wanted to talk to him after the meeting
about a food safety issue regarding a fish processor in his
neighborhood.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said within Alaska, Anchorage is the only
community that has its own food inspection program, so the
department does it for everyone else in the state.
4:42:05 PM
He said the State Veterinarian is located in the DEC and has a
number of responsibilities. He explained that a lot of human
diseases arise in animal populations; so it's important that the
Federal Human Health Lab track animal diseases. The DEC lab is
located directly next to it, so they can work collaboratively on
things like the bird flu.
4:42:56 PM
Another thing they do is surveillance of various contaminants in
fish in the state, analyzing fish tissues for mercury and other
potential contaminants. They are seeing an increase in levels of
mercury, for instance, and that gets reported to the Department
of Health and Social Services (DHSS) that analyzes what it means
in terms of potential impact to subsistence or other users in
Alaska.
Another thing that is new to the department is monitoring of the
Japanese tsunami marine debris. It is a very active area for the
Division of Environmental Health that just finished putting
together a plan for next summer. It is going really well with
good collaboration from the National Oceanic and the Atmospheric
Administration (NOAA). However, Commissioner Hartig said it is a
real challenge for the state, because we already have the bulk
of the debris.
SENATOR FRENCH asked which part of the state had been impacted
the most severely by the debris.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said that Alaska has collector beaches -
Montague Island, Kayak Island, and Hinchinbrook Island - that
get the bulk of marine debris even before the tsunami; but
Prince William Sound is getting hit the hardest (less so in
Southeast Alaska or the Chain).
SENATOR FRENCH asked what is happening with that stuff.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG answered they prioritize based on the impact
to the environment. They are primarily seeing Styrofoam and
polystyrene types of materials that breaks down into smaller
pieces in the surf. The big concern is that that the plastics
could be ingested by birds, mammals and other marine life that
would cause them to either quit eating because they feel full or
start actually plugging up their system. They are talking with
NOAA about getting better research on that and they are aware
that is the bulk of the type of debris that is being seen here.
You expect to get the higher windage items (that float higher in
the water) first. So, this year was no indication of what we
might get next season and the season after that.
He reported that they are evaluating how much of that debris
needs to be removed, but it's difficult because it's bulky and
light. It can't be burned because you get acid gas and other
things that are not good for human health. It's a question of
money and how much effort you want to put into these remote
areas. It's a balance that is being worked out among the
agencies and depends on federal funds and other things.
4:46:29 PM
SENATOR DYSON encouraged them to privatize the cleanup by
stationing receiving barges around and letting all the
commercial fishermen and recreational boaters pick it up,
compress it and weigh it or go by volume. But mobilize an army
of hundreds to go out and do it, because government isn't
equipped to.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said that is what they are doing; the only
time DEC would have someone out there is if they encountered
something that might be hazardous. Several experienced
contractors like Gulf of Alaska Keeper are experienced in going
out there and are part of the planning group.
SENATOR DYSON said he just hoped that some local folks could be
employed.
4:48:42 PM
The next department he talked about was Spill Prevention and
Response (SPAR) saying that first you try to prevent a spill and
the Industry Preparedness and Pipeline Operations programs work
on preventing spills at an industry level. The Prevention and
Emergency Response Program (PERP) is involved in prevention, but
they are also the SWAT crew if something spills or is about to
spill. Once that emergency situation is taken care off, if there
is still contamination that needs to be cleaned up or monitored
over time, that would be under the Contaminated Sites Program.
The last program is the Response Fund Administration People,
which he would address shortly.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said the total number of reported spills per
year on both land and water is gradually creeping down toward
the 1700 range from 1500 to 2000.
SENATOR MICCICHE said that prevention science and best practices
in certain industries have reduced spills dramatically and asked
if DEC has a program to help train people who are handling
fluids.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG answered that depending on the facility they
might be required to have a spill plan that would have
prevention measures in it. In that case, they would have to
describe what that training would be and the oversight. The
department looks at training and testing people and having
drills. They put a heavy emphasis on prevention, because that is
a lot easier than response.
SENATOR MICCICHE said a lot of reported spills are in smaller
operators or independents and it would be helpful also for those
who don't handle as many fluids to learn about some of those
practices.
4:51:49 PM
In 2012, 72 percent of reported spills volume was from diesel,
which are mainly from fuel tanks around the state. The big
industrial people like crude oil are around 10 percent.
SENATOR FAIRCLOUGH asked what is considered a "spill."
COMMISSIONER HARTIG replied that a spill is into the environment
as opposed to a release into another containment area.
SENATOR FAIRCLOUGH asked for a quantity.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said he would get the minimum volume and
range. It would vary, but you look for a pattern of going down.
4:54:14 PM
Historically half the spills happen on federal properties and 33
percent on private, the rest are on local government and state
properties.
4:54:42 PM
He said this division also does drills and exercises and the
regional government response plans; they work with local
communities emphasizing training people to be first responders
and installing equipment in these communities so it's readily
available in the event of a spill. Most spills are small.
Marine transportation is one area that is being worked on
closely: you have the goods going between North America and Asia
on the great circle shipping route and that is increasing with
bitumen and coal coming from the Northwest ports to Asia. Drift
groundings have happened in that area like the Selendang Ayu.
The Northern sea route goes through the Bering Straits and 46
ships went through it last year. Southeast Alaska might be the
scariest area because of the large cruise ships in confined
areas where you might have passengers and fuel in the water at
the same time. Cook Inlet is similar to the Arctic in that it
has ice infested waters; it also has the big tides and
volcanoes, oil rigs and the big salmon fishery.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG showed a conceptual slide of what would be
needed for a marine disaster saying first of all, you have to be
able to recognize one; some ships don't speak English and how do
you track those and know when they are getting into problems? A
vessel has to go out to them if they have lost power, you have
to get a tow on them and have somewhere to take them that is
safe both from the weather and if there is a spill that is still
occurring that it is to someplace that won't impact valuable
resources in the area. Eventually you have to get them somewhere
where repairs can be done. This is what they look for in the
Aleutians as well as other areas.
4:57:37 PM
The Division of Industry Preparedness and Response works with
contingency plans. You have to have more than a plan, you have
to have the resources identified that you're going to implement
that plan with. Those plans are drilled so people actually know
how to perform them. This is unique to Alaska.
SENATOR FRENCH said when the BP Gulf spill happened, BP and some
of the oversight agencies suffered some embarrassment when it
turned out their plan had some significant holes in it -
protecting walruses was one. He asked the commissioner if he had
gone through some of the oil contingency plans on file with DEC
to a degree that made him certain Alaska wouldn't suffer the
same kind of embarrassment.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG replied yes, but he hoped Alaska wouldn't
have any of those kinds of situations. They looked at what
happened in the Gulf to see if anything could be learned; in
fact, Larry Dietrich, Director of SPAR, participated on the
national Coast Guard panel to review that incident.
CHAIR GIESSEL said it was 5:00 and asked if he could start on
slide 31 on Saturday, because he was at a significant part of
his responsibility with spill issues, water and waste water.
COMMISSIONER HARTIG said he would be happy to do that.
5:01:51 PM
Finding no further business to come before the Senate Resource
Committee, Chair Giessel adjourned the meeting at 5:01 p.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| SRES ADF&G Dept. Overview for 2013.01.30.pdf |
SRES 1/30/2013 3:30:00 PM |
|
| SRES DEC Overview 2013.01.30 FINAL2.pdf |
SRES 1/30/2013 3:30:00 PM |